[atari 2600]

Originally Posted by ricechex

Don't be swayed. If we do not control the borders and account for illegals etc.,the driving force and the trend will continue to be to drive the cost of workers down.

I work at a major publishing firm, and we have just set up two major pipelines, circuits, to Indian firms to begin sending heavy data about our operations. We're hearing outsourcing. It's the same principle. Lowest costs possible for business, and american workers getting axed. What kills me is they say they're doing what's best for the company AND it's employees. haha. But how's that, by becoming ex-employees?

I got off on a tangent, but it's relative, nonetheless. We have got to figure out a way to thwart this trend of lowest cost priority, or else it's no more middle class, and low, barely liavable, wages for american workers and ultimately everyone; immigrants, illegals included, save the top echalon of tax break millionaires. That's the trend.

Originally Posted by atari 2600

If the corporate pigs were not benefiting from illegal mexican workers being here in America then you better believe that the National Guard would be called out & the protesters would be forced by tank escort to march right back to Mexico.

Think about it. If you truly care. Think about the fact that hiring illegal immigrants is a violation of the federal rackeetering act for a reason. It hurts Americans & the illegal immigrants themselves. Companies that hire or go out seeking to hire illegal immigrants are enabling them to stay illegal, so naturally, it has bled over into a problem with too many immigrants either not bothering or making the sacrifices of time necessary to become legal citizens. what part of reality don't you get exactly?

Originally Posted by atari 2600

Illegal immigrants contribute to a culture of indentured servitude & do a disservice to themselves & their own potential by not becoming legal American citizens first. By being illegal aliens, they minimize their abilty to achieve prosperity by lawful means & they subjugate themselves to any number of employer labor abuses. The most obvious of which is that they cannot expect to be guaranteed regular hours, overtime pay or a minimum wage.
None of this should be too tough to figure out if one actually cares about the people at the heart of this issue instead of just waxing together in unison being all "peace & love & understanding, dude" which basically amounts to complete & utter mental masturbation; I fail to see how it accomplishes or solves anything or serves to even further a real discussion.

I understand that what protesters are protesting about. They want unionization basically. It's not going to happen. Naturalization & a road to recovery might hopefully might be on the horizon but the rich business owners of America that exploit illegal immigrants are never going to give them the security of unionized workers. To do so would take away the perceived advantages of hiring them in the first place. If these protests raise consciousness about the issue or the intrinisic value of human rights, then that's great. But pack me another hit in the peace pipe, because that's probably just dreaming, truth be told.

I never wrote or tried to imply that I have no sympathy for illegal immigrants.
Instead the very first thing I wrote was:

Originally Posted by atari 2600

I'm not against immigration. Only a fool would be. I acknowledge & fervently & firmly believe that immigration, i.e. the melting pot, is what helped make this country great. But, like the Sheriff coarsely alluded, it should be done legally. The bureaucracy for gaining legal citizenship should be streamlined & made altogether more accessible for those that would like to call America home, but in this post 9/11 day & age that's gonna be a tough nut to crack.

then i begin with an analogy that I prefaced by writing it was "sort of an unfair comparison, but" & a certain poster deliberately several posts later tried to take issue with me as not be sympathetic to the plight of illegal immigrants & all the varying extenuating circumstances of their life.

I actually bring factual information into the debate & most of the rest of you just are blowing each other off trying to look good or goofing off at my expense. My posting history at this board & the old one demonstrates that I truly have passion & concern, whereas a certain other poster's demonstrates that he is a petty individual. Think about that. Think about the fact that you are ignore listed & that I will not mention you if you do not mention me. You are free to quote & provide rebuttal, but the little flame games you pathetically enjoy so much are finshed. Keep my name out of your posts other than as a quote or making a valid, reasonable point.

Originally Posted by atari 2600

The truth is that rights are, always have been & most probably always will be a social construct, which means that the rights that we have that shouldn't ever be able to be taken away are actually really just granted to us under certain conditions. If that seems unfair, then I suggest you follow my applicable suggestion that I repeatedly offer forth & start spreading the word about passing a constitutional amendment to end all repeat terms of office in this country to possibly see Human Rights Justice really done one day.